benryves wrote:
elfprince13 wrote:
Apple troll here: Microsoft is dropping support for plugins (Flash included) in the default browser for Windows 8. How does this make you feel?

It's not the "default" browser, it's the Metro browser.


And isn't Metro the default interface for Windows 8? I haven't seen Microsoft talk about or show anything else.
elfprince13 wrote:
Apple troll here: Microsoft is dropping support for plugins (Flash included) in the default browser for Windows 8. How does this make you feel?


Like I'll continue to use a real browser such as Firefox. FF6 works beautifully on Win8 and it's a lot less buggy than IE10.
elfprince13 wrote:
I haven't seen Microsoft talk about or show anything else.

I guess there's not much to show off or talk about in the regular desktop UI as that's much the same as Windows 7. The current demo is very much biased towards demonstrating new features (as that's what Microsoft are trying to promote, after all). I can't see anyone using the touch version of IE on their regular desktops.
benryves wrote:
elfprince13 wrote:
I haven't seen Microsoft talk about or show anything else.

I guess there's not much to show off or talk about in the regular desktop UI as that's much the same as Windows 7. The current demo is very much biased towards demonstrating new features (as that's what Microsoft are trying to promote, after all). I can't see anyone using the touch version of IE on their regular desktops.

Huh. All I've heard about Windows 8 is that "you can launch the old style desktop (as an application) if you want it", and in fact Steven Sinofksy (president of the Windows Division at Microsoft) said the following:

Quote:
We believe there is room for a more elegant, perhaps a more nuanced, approach. You get a beautiful, fast and fluid, Metro style interface and a huge variety of new apps to use. These applications have new attributes (a platform) that go well beyond the graphical styling (much to come on this at Build). As we showed, you get an amazing touch experience, and also one that works with mouse, trackpad, and keyboard. And if you want to stay permanently immersed in that Metro world, you will never see the desktopówe wonít even load it (literally the code will not be loaded) unless you explicitly choose to go there! This is Windows reimagined.


They are expecting that most people will want to use Metro with mouse and keyboard.
elfprince13 wrote:
They are expecting that most people will want to use Metro with mouse and keyboard.

Which is a patently stupid idea - one size does definitely not fit all where user interfaces are concerned. The best you can do is cater for the lowest common denominator (which would be the chunky, dumbed-down touch UI) but that's pretty cumbersome to use with a mouse and keyboard.

For basic "consumer" applications (web browser, email, Twitter feed reader, video player) fair enough. What about Microsoft Office, Visual Studio, or Photoshop (for example?)
elfprince13 wrote:
They are expecting that most people will want to use Metro with mouse and keyboard.
That's not how I read it. I read it as saying you could.
Quote:
As we showed, you get an amazing touch experience, and also one that works with mouse, trackpad, and keyboard. And if you want to stay permanently immersed in that Metro world, you will never see the desktop...
"If you want to", not "most people will want to".
They'd be smart to offer a choice first thing in the set up to allow people to choose what they want by default. We all know they'd not pay attention to such an idea, though.

I am just interested to see if this OS will be ME to 2k, or XP to Vista. In sense of usability, performance, etc.
merthsoft wrote:
elfprince13 wrote:
They are expecting that most people will want to use Metro with mouse and keyboard.
That's not how I read it. I read it as saying you could.

They bring you to the Metro interface and then you have to take action to get from there to the classic desktop.
Personally, I kind of like the Mosaic interface. It's a lot better than that stupid "All programs" list from Windows 7. However, it seems rather unstable in the demo. When I first installed Windows 8, all of my programs showed up as tiles in the mosaic, which was a great feature. One shutdown/Reboot cycle later and all of those tiles are gone with no apparent way to bring them back. Also, none of the apps can connect to the internet anymore.
benryves wrote:
elfprince13 wrote:
They are expecting that most people will want to use Metro with mouse and keyboard.

Which is a patently stupid idea - one size does definitely not fit all where user interfaces are concerned. The best you can do is cater for the lowest common denominator (which would be the chunky, dumbed-down touch UI) but that's pretty cumbersome to use with a mouse and keyboard.
Heartily seconded. And speaking of networking, although Ubuntu and other OSes happily recognize my VM's network adapter, thus far Windows 8 has refused to do so.
benryves wrote:
Which is a patently stupid idea - one size does definitely not fit all where user interfaces are concerned. The best you can do is cater for the lowest common denominator (which would be the chunky, dumbed-down touch UI) but that's pretty cumbersome to use with a mouse and keyboard.

For basic "consumer" applications (web browser, email, Twitter feed reader, video player) fair enough. What about Microsoft Office, Visual Studio, or Photoshop (for example?)


It is stupid, yes, but that's what they are doing.
Kllrnohj wrote:
benryves wrote:
Which is a patently stupid idea - one size does definitely not fit all where user interfaces are concerned. The best you can do is cater for the lowest common denominator (which would be the chunky, dumbed-down touch UI) but that's pretty cumbersome to use with a mouse and keyboard.

For basic "consumer" applications (web browser, email, Twitter feed reader, video player) fair enough. What about Microsoft Office, Visual Studio, or Photoshop (for example?)


It is stupid, yes, but that's what they are doing.


In fact, Ballmer just announced that they are actively pursuing Metro-izing Office. http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9220091/Microsoft_CEO_hints_at_Metro_ization_of_Office
I understand why Microsoft is pursing tablets so hard with Windows, since the more devices that are using Windows, the more licenses they sell and money they get, but I don't really understand the whole idea behind tablets in the first place. I understand eReaders, I get netbooks and thin-and-light laptops, but the whole tablet appeal (for equal to or more than the price of a netbook or laptop, no less) just goes straight over my head.
KermMartian wrote:
I understand why Microsoft is pursing tablets so hard with Windows, since the more devices that are using Windows, the more licenses they sell and money they get, but I don't really understand the whole idea behind tablets in the first place. I understand eReaders, I get netbooks and thin-and-light laptops, but the whole tablet appeal (for equal to or more than the price of a netbook or laptop, no less) just goes straight over my head.


o.0

http://www.cemetech.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5922

-_-
Kllrnohj wrote:
KermMartian wrote:
I understand why Microsoft is pursing tablets so hard with Windows, since the more devices that are using Windows, the more licenses they sell and money they get, but I don't really understand the whole idea behind tablets in the first place. I understand eReaders, I get netbooks and thin-and-light laptops, but the whole tablet appeal (for equal to or more than the price of a netbook or laptop, no less) just goes straight over my head.


o.0

http://www.cemetech.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5922

-_-
I think one of you, if not both, are confusing & generalizing the term "tablet" that is both associated with the Honeycomb Enabled Tablets & iPad, as well as laptops that can double as a "tablet."
comicIDIOT wrote:
I think one of you, if not both, are confusing & generalizing the term "tablet" that is both associated with the Honeycomb Enabled Tablets & iPad, as well as laptops that can double as a "tablet."


How could it possibly be me confusing/generalizing anything?

Also, I believe the word you are looking for is "slate". Slate tablet vs. convertible tablet.
The appeal to tablets, for me at least, is that it's like a PADD from Star Trek. Not sure why I'd want to spend $500 on a movie prop though...
FYI, Kllrnohj, you know exactly what I mean. Tablet != Tablet PC. Every laptop I've owned has been a tablet PC, as they're full laptops running a full OS with a full keyboard and full features to run all of my programs. They have hard drives and big, high-res screens, and on top of all that, I can use the digitizer to draw and sketch and take notes. A tablet is an underpowered, overpriced screen backed with annoying specs, a generally weak digitizer, and a painful OS. No keyboard. No desktop-OS applications (except, I guess, with Windows Cool.
I would not mind if I can use Windows 8 on my archos (which I assume falls under a category of tablet Win8 can be installed on)
KermMartian wrote:
They have hard drives and big, high-res screens, and on top of all that, I can use the digitizer to draw and sketch and take notes. A tablet is an underpowered, overpriced screen backed with annoying specs, a generally weak digitizer, and a painful OS. No keyboard. No desktop-OS applications (except, I guess, with Windows Cool.

You've clearly never used an iPad. Pretty much the only thing it is lacking of the features you've mentioned is an on-board development environment, but
a) You can jailbreak it and have one
b) Who the hell wants to run a compiler on processors with those specs anyway? (this is true of any tablet with the battery life to be a worthwhile tablet).
  
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