TheStorm wrote:
I should realy get back to learning lIsp or Python...
Than maybe some of this would make sense to me Smile


Learn Lisp if you want to pretend to program (and maybe write some scripts for other programs), learn Python if you actually want to code and produce programs.
Kllrnohj wrote:
TheStorm wrote:
I should realy get back to learning lIsp or Python...
Than maybe some of this would make sense to me Smile


Learn Lisp if you want to pretend to program (and maybe write some scripts for other programs), learn Python if you actually want to code and produce programs.

Ok I'll look into python then I was most likely going to do that anyway considering I do not know anyone hwo knows lisp. Most of the reading I did suggested learning python, c, and lisp.(not in that order) and lisp sounded interesting but yeah Python from what I hear is much easier to learn and more commonly used.
I'd learn C first and then python if I were you. What do you guys think?
KermMartian wrote:
I'd learn C first and then python if I were you. What do you guys think?


I think you have it backwards - TheStorm is correct in his ordering. Learn Python to learn the *proper* way of coding (in modern terms) - then learn C just because you should, then quickly forget most of it and go back to Python (or perhaps C#)
Kllrnohj wrote:
KermMartian wrote:
I'd learn C first and then python if I were you. What do you guys think?


I think you have it backwards - TheStorm is correct in his ordering. Learn Python to learn the *proper* way of coding (in modern terms) - then learn C just because you should, then quickly forget most of it and go back to Python (or perhaps C#)
I disagree. C teaches you all the basics about functions, variables, program structure and flow, etc, then Python teaches you that whitespace matters. Razz
KermMartian wrote:
I disagree. C teaches you all the basics about functions, variables, program structure and flow, etc, then Python teaches you that whitespace matters. Razz


C is a really bad language to learn on. Its frustrating and pointers will rape you. Its also not OOP, so you learn how to do things in the old, outdated way.
Kllrnohj wrote:
KermMartian wrote:
I disagree. C teaches you all the basics about functions, variables, program structure and flow, etc, then Python teaches you that whitespace matters. Razz


C is a really bad language to learn on. Its frustrating and pointers will rape you. Its also not OOP, so you learn how to do things in the old, outdated way.
Fine, then start with C++ if you must. Pointers are important, and if you avoid pointers for now you're only setting yourself up to get owned later in your programming career.
KermMartian wrote:
Fine, then start with C++ if you must. Pointers are important, and if you avoid pointers for now you're only setting yourself up to get owned later in your programming career.


Pointers really aren't that important anymore. None of the major languages even have pointers, much less use them (C#, Java, etc... Hell, even C++ doesn't really use pointers the way the C does). That, and pointers are most certainly NOT something to introduce to a new programmer.

Storm: Start with Python, and when you have it down pretty well (say after ~4-6 months of usage), then learn some C/C++ (just enough to know the syntax and basic usage - as these are the languages other tuts often will reference)
My plan was to learn Python ofirst then c and then Lisp. the book I read suggested lisp as just a good language to learn and would help you program in other languages.
Despite our differences, I think Kllrnohj and I would both agree that a proficiency in LISP is mostly a waste of time.
KermMartian wrote:
Despite our differences, I think Kllrnohj and I would both agree that a proficiency in LISP is mostly a waste of time.


Yup, I can't think of any programs that use it. LUA maybe, as it is used for "extensions" to programs (ie, Supreme Commander uses LUA for the games scripting engine, so if you know LUA you can make mods pretty easy)
KermMartian wrote:
Despite our differences, I think Kllrnohj and I would both agree that a proficiency in LISP is mostly a waste of time.

A few websites use it but they started before python or for that matter many other lanugages existed.
TheStorm wrote:
A few websites use it but they started before python or for that matter many other lanugages existed.


What do you mean "a few websites use it"? Lisp isn't a web language...
I know that what I mean is the used it for their server based software that ran the website. I belive it was used by a site that allowed peple to make thier own web based stores.
TheStorm wrote:
I know that what I mean is the used it for their server based software that ran the website. I belive it was used by a site that allowed peple to make thier own web based stores.
Whoever wrote something like that in LISP fails severely at life.
KermMartian wrote:
TheStorm wrote:
I know that what I mean is the used it for their server based software that ran the website. I belive it was used by a site that allowed peple to make thier own web based stores.
Whoever wrote something like that in LISP fails severely at life.


Its possible (there is a mod_lisp for apache), but I highly doubt anyone uses it beyond just seeing if they can. Only other people who use it are probably the Lisp die-hards...
i thought by know that you would know that python is a memory hoger!!! That's the most important tip you should grab of it! Yes it holds nice functions but not for a 1 day long of work, i have run into problems when i once made a program to simulate the brownian movement of some particles... it just have hogged nothing more than 4GB of ram... sorry but python is not for me... i learned i have used it in some programs and i forget it exists when comes to make programs...

So if you think your program will be very heavy or complex for computer just think of another language to program, because python will not be the way!!!
rayden wrote:
i thought by know that you would know that python is a memory hoger!!! That's the most important tip you should grab of it! Yes it holds nice functions but not for a 1 day long of work, i have run into problems when i once made a program to simulate the brownian movement of some particles... it just have hogged nothing more than 4GB of ram... sorry but python is not for me... i learned i have used it in some programs and i forget it exists when comes to make programs...

So if you think your program will be very heavy or complex for computer just think of another language to program, because python will not be the way!!!


Who the fuck codes a memory and/or CPU intensive task in a SCRIPTING LANGUAGE? Seriously, thats just epic fail on your part, not python's...

But still, I think you just suck at coding in Python, as Python uses less RAM than Java ( http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/debian/benchmark.php?test=all&lang=python&lang2=java ), around the same as C# Mono ( http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/debian/benchmark.php?test=all&lang=python&lang2=csharp ), less than Perl ( http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/debian/benchmark.php?test=all&lang=python&lang2=perl ), and less than PHP ( http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/debian/benchmark.php?test=all&lang=python&lang2=php ) - hell, Python is better than PHP at everything Very Happy
IS it better than MATLAB or MATHEMATICA, i think not, and in case you don't know many physics algorithms are first tested in scripted languages like matlab and only then transferred to another language!!! Another crazy thing is that MATLAB is hell faster when comes to vector computations it's as fast as C programs and it's an script lang as python so. And better you suck at python!
rayden wrote:
IS it better than MATLAB or MATHEMATICA, i think not, and in case you don't know many physics algorithms are first tested in scripted languages like matlab and only then transferred to another language!!! Another crazy thing is that MATLAB is hell faster when comes to vector computations it's as fast as C programs and it's an script lang as python so. And better you suck at python!
Matlab's powerful, but it's an amazingly slow scripting language for many things due to the overhead of its flexibility.
  
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