In December 2019, I got my latest laptop, a Razer Blade. It was a solid upgrade at the time, (16gb ram + 1660ti + i7-9750H + 2x 1TB SSD (Aftermarket upgraded)). Throughout the intervening time, It's been a great machine, but there have been a number of issues with it. Most notably, Linux support. It's pretty good, but it took a heck of a lot of configuration the first time to get it working.

So I'm open to other options, but there are some (rather odd) requirements:

1) Linux support - suspend has to work, using super recent kernel versions is okay as I'd be using them anyway
2) Beefy GPU with (hopefully) at least 16Gb of vram. This is one of the issues I ran into with the 1660ti (which has 6Gb). AMD or Nvidia are equally acceptable as long as it gives good performance.
3) Beefy CPU (latest-generation Intel or AMD, doesn't matter as long as it works well. Multi core and single core are of equal importance. Note point 5; Intel might be a better option)
4) Multiple storage bays. Preferably NVMe compatible.
5) Thunderbolt is a big plus
6) At least 32Gb ram. I've run out before with 16, and I have to be careful not to go over the limit. Must not be soldered on.
7) Might be odd, but I don't really care about screen quality. I guess something high-res or with a fast refresh rate is nice, but I'd be happy with 1080p 60Hz.
8) At least two USB 3 type A ports.
9) Touchpad without physical buttons preferred, but if it does I'd prefer the touchpad to be usable without the buttons (like the T450 touchpad)
10) Keyboard with readable font. Some gaming laptop keyboards look super janky, like a preschooler with some vague notion of what is "cool" scribbled some blocky, sharp-cornered Klingon glyphs onto the keycaps
11) Should add that good cooling is an absolute must
12) Budget <=5K USD

EDIT:
13) Metal case (good point Mateo)

Intended use case: ML stuff, school, programming, game dev, some gaming (outside of what I make)
Macbook

(I'm kidding, of course)
Michael2_3B wrote:
Macbook

Well, that doesn't fit:
1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 8, 11, or 12
Get a MAX-15 or the MAG-15R.

https://www.eluktronics.com/MAX-15
https://www.eluktronics.com/MAG-15R

I personally have the MAG-15 which is a slightly older version of the MAG-15R.
MateoConLechuga wrote:

My friend got a MAX 15 last year and it's actually pretty great, they don't have any major complaints. They mainly run applications like Solid Edge but they also occasionally run some AAA games. Laptop performs really well for both.
Michael0x18 wrote:
Michael2_3B wrote:
Macbook

Well, that doesn't fit:
1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 8, 11, or 12


Well technically if you take an MBP with M1 Pro or even Max, it does fit 1 (see here), 2 and 3 (although it's not intel or amd), 5, 11 maybe depending on how you consider that, and 12 definitely (5k$ is a lot even for Apple lol).
However 6 doesn't fit (RAM is in the SoC), 8 neither since it's only USB-C (well Thunderbolt 4)

But anyway, it's probably not what you're looking for I suppose Razz
Have a look at Apple silicon MacBooks still
Well, if I can find one that happens to satisfy enough (the vast majority) of my requirements, I'd be happy to consider it as an option. Could you please suggest one?
MateoConLechuga wrote:
Get a MAX-15 or the MAG-15R.

https://www.eluktronics.com/MAX-15
https://www.eluktronics.com/MAG-15R

I personally have the MAG-15 which is a slightly older version of the MAG-15R.


I remember you recommending me that computer 3 years ago when I asked for laptop suggestions XD
Michael0x18 wrote:
Well, if I can find one that happens to satisfy enough (the vast majority) of my requirements, I'd be happy to consider it as an option. Could you please suggest one?

Yeah, it's a crazy idea, and it's totally justifiable given their track record (ie. intel Macs) but the new Apple silicon Mac notebooks are supposed to be pretty impressive. From what I've heard from reviewers all over the internet, the 14/16 inch MacBook Pros meet the requirements as follows:

1) Linux support - Asahi Linux is a flavor of Linux designed to run on the M1/M2 family of SoCs. They're found at https://asahilinux.org, and have been developing it to run "polished enough to run as your daily OS". You can do it through partitioning your drive in Disk Utility (https://support.apple.com/guide/disk-utility/welcome/mac). And yes, suspend should work (https://twitter.com/AsahiLinux/status/1500037875655929858)
2) GPU - On Apple silicon your RAM bank is also used simultaneously as your VRAM. If you buy a Mac with 64GB RAM, then you get 64GB VRAM. Apparently Macs manage RAM in the same way as iOS does, so it's incredibly optimized. No official comment from Apple though, so :shrug:
For what it's worth, here's a synthetic GPU comparison. The Blade specs in the test to your Blade are identical, and the Mac it's being compared to is a base spec M1 Max MacBook Pro with 32GB RAM. https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/compute/compare/4758143?baseline=4743115. The results here are for OpenCL, used in Windows but deprecated on Mac. The native, actively-maintained Metal graphics framework provides these results: https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/compute/4756179
3) CPU - Synthetic CPU comparison also. The specs are identical to your Blade. The Mac config in this test is a base MacBook Pro, with 32GB RAM and the 10-core M1 Max. https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/compare/14666794?baseline=14527007
4) Storage bays - This is the downside of Apple products; user upgradeability is pretty much nonexistent. Your two options are a) external Thunderbolt drives, or b) cloud storage.
5) Thunderbolt - Mac notebooks since (I think) 2010 have supported Thunderbolt. The 2021 models of MacBook Pro come with three Thunderbolt 4 ports.
6) RAM - I heard you were already looking at Apple silicon Macs, so here's another con. RAM is soldered on, since it's a part of the M1 SoC. Not sure if this is a dealbreaker for you, and heads up - 64GB is the max you can configure up to.
7) Screen/display - Retina displays are very high resolution. MacBook Pros have mini-LED 120hz displays that (by a 3456x2234 native resolution) are about 3.5K.
8) USB-A - Another potential dealbreaker. Macs haven't had USB-A ports since 2015. You'd need a hub or infamous ~dongle~.
9) Touchpad - Macs use "Force Touch" trackpads. They're basically static and use haptic feedback to emulate a click. They kind of let you click into things with a harder click, like URLs to preview them, or a word to bring up its definition. I love mine, and apparently many others do, but it seems like more of subjective thing.
10) Keyboard - You get a scissor switch mechanism keyboard with an extremely readable font on it, lol. There's an additional function row of keys above the number row that control things like volume, brightness, media playback. You also get Touch ID (fingerprint identification). Logs you into the system, like Windows Hello, and also integrates with websites and apps.
11) Cooling - Another part of the Intel-era track record; they've since thickened their chassis and beefed up their fans since the whole i9 throttling fiasco.
12) Budget - Adriweb mentioned that $5K is quite a bit, even for Apple. Yes, it's true haha. The highest specced MacBook Pro will run you about $6K, and if you downgrade to 4TB of storage, then it's about $5K.
13) Aluminium - https://youtube.com/watch?v=_dsfbrAhFDM

So in summary, I'd go with a 16-inch M1 Max MacBook Pro since it meets the majority of your requirements. The only reason I'd pick the 16-inch model over the 14-inch model is because your Blade has a 15.6" display, so a 16" would be closest to that.
The potential dealbreakers in your case are upgradeable RAM, storage bays, and USB-A. The latter two can be solved with a product like this - https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08JCCPQZD - but it's stupid that you should even need something like this in the first place. USB-C is nice, but just give back the USB-A, Apple!!
Oh, and a note - Apple silicon SoCs have dedicated Neural Engines in them that greatly accelerate ML performance. If that's what you're looking for. In addition, since they run on ARM architecture, macOS ships with a translation layer that translates any non-native app from x64 to ARM at run. But, as it's been roughly 2.5 years since Apple silicon came out, most apps are running native now.
If you end up wanting to try a Mac, Apple has a solid 14-day return policy in case you don't like it.

Happy laptop shopping!

(edits because I'm super bad at writing everything down at once haha.)
drive002share wrote:
Michael0x18 wrote:
Well, if I can find one that happens to satisfy enough (the vast majority) of my requirements, I'd be happy to consider it as an option. Could you please suggest one?

Yeah, it's a crazy idea, and it's totally justifiable given their track record (ie. intel Macs) but the new Apple silicon Mac notebooks are supposed to be pretty impressive. From what I've heard from reviewers all over the internet, the 14/16 inch MacBook Pros meet the requirements as follows:

1) Linux support - Asahi Linux is a flavor of Linux designed to run on the M1/M2 family of SoCs. They're found at https://asahilinux.org, and have been developing it to run "polished enough to run as your daily OS". You can do it through partitioning your drive in Disk Utility (https://support.apple.com/guide/disk-utility/welcome/mac). And yes, suspend should work (https://twitter.com/AsahiLinux/status/1500037875655929858)
2) GPU - On Apple silicon your RAM bank is also used simultaneously as your VRAM. If you buy a Mac with 64GB RAM, then you get 64GB VRAM. Apparently Macs manage RAM in the same way as iOS does, so it's incredibly optimized. No official comment from Apple though, so :shrug:
For what it's worth, here's a synthetic GPU comparison. The Blade specs in the test to your Blade are identical, and the Mac it's being compared to is a base spec M1 Max MacBook Pro with 32GB RAM. https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/compute/compare/4758143?baseline=4743115. The results here are for OpenCL, used in Windows but deprecated on Mac. The native, actively-maintained Metal graphics framework provides these results: https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/compute/4756179
3) CPU - Synthetic CPU comparison also. The specs are identical to your Blade. The Mac config in this test is a base MacBook Pro, with 32GB RAM and the 10-core M1 Max. https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/compare/14666794?baseline=14527007
4) Storage bays - This is the downside of Apple products; user upgradeability is pretty much nonexistent. Your two options are a) external Thunderbolt drives, or b) cloud storage.
5) Thunderbolt - Mac notebooks since (I think) 2010 have supported Thunderbolt. The 2021 models of MacBook Pro come with three Thunderbolt 4 ports.
6) RAM - I heard you were already looking at Apple silicon Macs, so here's another con. RAM is soldered on, since it's a part of the M1 SoC. Not sure if this is a dealbreaker for you, and heads up - 64GB is the max you can configure up to.
7) Screen/display - Retina displays are very high resolution. MacBook Pros have mini-LED 120hz displays that (by a 3456x2234 native resolution) are about 3.5K.
Cool USB-A - Another potential dealbreaker. Macs haven't had USB-A ports since 2015. You'd need a hub or infamous ~dongle~.
9) Touchpad - Macs use "Force Touch" trackpads. They're basically static and use haptic feedback to emulate a click. They kind of let you click into things with a harder click, like URLs to preview them, or a word to bring up its definition. I love mine, and apparently many others do, but it seems like more of subjective thing.
10) Keyboard - You get a butterfly mechanism keyboard with an extremely readable font on it, 0x5. There's an additional function row of keys above the number row that control things like volume, brightness, media playback. You also get Touch ID (fingerprint identification). Logs you into the system, like Windows Hello, and also integrates with websites and apps.
11) Cooling - Another part of the Intel-era track record; they've thickened their chassis and beefed up their fans since the whole i9 throttling fiasco.
12) Budget - Adriweb mentioned that $5K is quite a bit, even for Apple. Yes, it's true haha. The highest specced MacBook Pro will run you about $6K, and if you downgrade to 4TB of storage, then it's about $5K.
13) Aluminium - https://youtube.com/watch?v=_dsfbrAhFDM

So in summary, I'd go with a 16-inch M1 Max MacBook Pro since it meets the majority of your requirements. The only reason I'd pick the 16-inch model over the 14-inch model is because your Blade has a 15.6" display, so a 16" would be closest to that.
The potential dealbreakers in your case are upgradeable RAM, storage bays, and USB-A. The latter two can be solved with a product like this - https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08JCCPQZD - but it's kind of stupid that you would need something like that in the long term. If you end up wanting to try it out, Apple has a solid 14-day return policy in case you don't like it.

Happy laptop shopping!

(edits because I'm super bad at writing everything down at once haha.)


I would definitely NOT choose an apple M1/M2 laptop for machine learning. They obviously do not support CUDA and TensorRT, and OpenCL/OpenVINO support in common machine learning frameworks are still in infancy, with significantly worse performance even on the same GPU.

16GB of VRAM is a huge lot: the only consumer cards on the market right now with that amount, are the Titan RTX, the RTX 3090, RTX 3090Ti, RX6800, RX6800XT, RX6900XT and RX6950XT (maybe some workstation cards also have that, but they would be rare and even more expensive). You could wait for the RTX 4000 series, which have >16GB of VRAM for 4080, 4090 and 4090 TI (from the latest leaks). There is currently less info on the RX7000 series, but don't expect a 16GB RX7600 or something. All these card mentioned above are very power hungry parts, so laptops with them would be very hot and still be slower than their desktop counterparts. In fact, there are currently no laptops on the market that use an RTX 3090 at all, probably because it's close to impossible to cool it in a laptop.

While it is possible to use an RTX 3090 Ti or something with an eGPU enclosure, the enclosure incurs a performance penalty. In addition, the enclosure is not cheap, either.

My advice would be to get a PC, and log in remotely with a cheap laptop. That would give you much more bang for your buck, if you are looking for high end performance.
Anyone recommending a mac here is an idiot and has no idea how computers work.
Well, as I said earlier, "probably not what you're looking for" which is why I didn't get into the details contrary to drive002share lol

The problem is not really for "school, programming" (where a mac is just fine), but rather for the rest: "game dev, some gaming (outside of what I make)", where, let's be honest, it's not the best platform.
Regarding "ML stuff" it would depend on what you use on the software-side. The hardware is certainly fit for ML stuff, that's pretty much what a part of it is made for.
MateoConLechuga wrote:
Anyone recommending a mac here is an idiot and has no idea how computers work.

:(
Macs are fine computers. Just not for what he wants.
Adriweb wrote:
Well, as I said earlier, "probably not what you're looking for" which is why I didn't get into the details contrary to drive002share 0x5

The problem is not really for "school, programming" (where a mac is just fine), but rather for the rest: "game dev, some gaming (outside of what I make)", where, let's be honest, it's not the best platform.
Regarding "ML stuff" it would depend on what you use on the software-side. The hardware is certainly fit for ML stuff, that's pretty much what a part of it is made for.

Hardware is useless if the software can't use it efficiently.
Well, I did end up getting another suggestion, which looks really good:
https://shop.asus.com/us/rog/90nr08r1-m002p0-gu603zx.html

This puts the number of suggestions I've received from you guys to three, and this third one looks like a really good choice. Just seems to be kind of hard to find, and it's out of stock from the manufacturer atm.
Since money doesn't seem to be an issue, wouldn't it be more practical to buy a $700-$800 laptop for school/work/commute and then sink the rest in to an actual setup? You're going to get a lot more bang for your buck buying a $3,000 desktop vs a $3,000 laptop. The desktop will last longer by virtue of its immobility. Also, if a component deteriorates or otherwise needs to be replaced, interchanging the hardware in a tower will be infinitely easier than replacing it in the laptop chassis (which, I mean, is virtually impossible anyway).

But....
This is coming from a guy who spent two grand on a laptop last year. Laughing
Good luck on your search m8.
Yeah I personally am planning to set up a server machine and a thin client with a PCoIP connection. I'm thinking a chromebook could look nice. Just need to find a 10gbit LAN at least - seems like a few ITX/microITX boards are available with this.
KaluW_ wrote:
Since money doesn't seem to be an issue, wouldn't it be more practical to buy a $700-$800 laptop for school/work/commute and then sink the rest in to an actual setup? You're going to get a lot more bang for your buck buying a $3,000 desktop vs a $3,000 laptop.


This is what I did, to some degree. Realized my laptop was always plugged in and I always sat in the same spot with it. Ended up selling it for $2k a year later and bought a tablet and a desktop for less than that and the desktop had virtually identical or better specs. Now I do my note taking and general on-the-go stuff with the tablet and when I get back home I have the desktop for the power.

I can do some stuff with the tablet, such as video/photo management before I get home. Basically using it to browse files off the card and making notes. This is beneficial since I can identify key moments before editing. The tablet will last 8 hours on a plane, a bus, or in a park while my laptop would have needed power an hour in.

I'm not saying laptops are dumb, but personally I'm never buying a laptop for myself again. Not only for the things above but the ergonomics are awful when using it as a laptop. The trackpad is always in a bad place and you always have to look down at the screen.

I have a laptop at work and there's one hour every week where it isn't plugged into it's dock with a proper keyboard and mouse, and monitor height and I hate that hour every time.
  
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